When Did Writing Non-Fiction Get to be So Fun?


I am seriously thrilled to have Vicky Alvear Shecter visiting with us here today! And I’m even more thrilled that she’s still speaking to me. Because I asked her all sorts of questions about her latest book, Cleopatra Rules! The Amazing Life of the Original Teen Queen over at Finders & Keepers. Then I sorta badgered her to come over here and talk about writing non-fiction. And then I kinda suggested she give away something to help my writer friends.

Vicky’s a bit of a history buff. Which is like saying The Beatles were a bit of a band. But Vicky’s not your typical dry, history writer. Her brand of story telling is witty, contemporary, and very kid friendly.

So here’s my first question: Was it harder or easier for you to sell a history book with such an irreverent style?
Harder! Not everyone is comfortable with my approach although, surprisingly, the folks who seem to like it the most are classicists. They “get it” that these are real stories about real people and they appreciate the attempt at making it more lively for kids.

In order to sell this approach, I had to make sure (as I say in your other interview) that my research was unimpeachable. I used primary sources wherever possible and had four esteemed researchers/professors vet the book for accuracy.

One reviewer said the voice in the book sounded like it was written for a teen blog. I think this person may have meant this as an insult but my response was—YES! That was exactly what I was going for!

The way I figure it, it is our responsibility to get kids excited about history, to ignite their fascination with this other world that still resonates in ours. With so many tech distractions, we have to grab ‘em early. There is plenty of time, later in high school and in college, to get all formal and stuffy. I just wanted to capture their interest and imagination.

The slang and humor in your book make it such a fun read—I almost forgot I was reading history! But as you mentioned, those endnotes were stuffed with impressive research. How does a writer find “unimpeachable” references and resources? And how do you talk people into being so helpful/generous if you haven’t sold the book yet?

As with most history books, I sought out primary sources where possible. What is so interesting, though, is that the only records we have of Cleo were written by Romans, who hated her. They had a vested interest in making her look bad in order to justify an illegal war against her.

So in addition to reading the Roman sources, it was important to read the works of academics and scholars who parsed out the political motivations behind the way Cleopatra was portrayed. So I read tons of secondary sources too in order to create a fuller picture.

The first person to read the book for me was a classicist at Emory University (Dr. Katrina Dickson) who vetted it for me before I even submitted it. My editor, Larry Rosler at Boyds Mill Press, later sent the manuscript to two experts in London—classicist Dr. Dorothy King and Egyptologist Dr. Okasha El Daly.

When I integrated all of their (thankfully minor) changes, I still felt that it would be useful to have a Cleo expert bless it. So we went to Dr. Prudence Jones, a professor at Montclair University and author of several works and films on Cleopatra, to give it a final once-over. She was gracious and helpful and turned the book around for us (it was already in layout form) very quickly. In fact, all of the experts who looked at the book were extraordinarily kind and helpful!

Wow. That’s a lot of work! But I’m sure it was helpful in your next project. I know you’ve got a YA fiction book based on Cleopatra’s daughter coming out in the fall of this year. What was the impetus for switching from non-fiction to fiction? And how difficult was the switch, in writing style and tone?

The impetus was that I was absolutely floored that no one seemed to even know that Cleopatra had a daughter and that she was the only one of her four children to survive into adulthood.

I mean, we’re talking the daughter of Cleopatra and Mark Antony! Can you imagine what it must have been like to live under the shadow of such a powerful mother? It seems like it was a classic YA story ready to happen—a story of survival and a young woman’s determination to carve her own identity in history.

The writing style and tone is VERY different in the novel. So different, that sometimes I wonder if I should’ve used a pseudonym. If people expect Cleopatra’s Moon, to be light and funny like my nonfiction books, they will be very surprised. In a good way, I hope.

Sounds very mysterious and very good! Maybe you can come back and dish some more with us? Oh! Wait! I also wanted to ask you about all those photos in the book. I’ve always wondered how an author gets permission for artwork and photos to be used in a non-fiction work?

Many of the photos were public domain photos. For those that weren’t, I had to get in touch with the photographer and ask permission (in writing of course). In other cases, we had to pay for the right to use them, usually with museum artifacts.

And as if answering TONS of questions wasn’t enough, I begged Vicky to bring a photo or two from her collection and share her funny captions. She does an occasional blog post called Photo Funnies that completely cracks me up. ‘Cause who doesn’t think men in skirts are HI-larious? (Well, besides the Scots)

“You mean we play this game with no hands? I thought you said no pants!”

Now, zip over to her blog, History with a Twist and follow Vicky. You’ll laugh some, and you’ll go “ewwww” occasionally, but you’ll end up scathingly brilliant! And you might even end up with a free critique! Vicky’s agreed to critique the first ten pages of a fiction or non-fiction manuscript for one lucky follower. Just let me know if you signed on to follow her at her blog, Facebook or Twitter. I’ll put your name in the drawing for each connection. And on Monday, I’ll draw a name and make your Valentine’s Day even sweeter!

P.S. If you want to know more about Cleopatra, and maybe win Cleopatra Rules!, zip over to Finders & Keepers and leave a comment. It’s that easy.

Thank you SO much for sharing your writing insights today, Vicky! Um, you are still speaking to me, right?

LOL! However, I’ve had to put my fingers on ice since I had to type so much!

Finding a Keeper: Cleopatra Rules! (Oh, Yeah!)

Okay, let’s imagine you’re in class, or the library, or even sitting in front of your computer, facing the Dreaded History Project, which just happens to be on Ancient Egypt. Oh, and that kid that sits in the back and never says anything got the pyramids and the mummies and the grave robbers and all that other cool stuff. And you got…Cleopatra.

Great. What’s so exciting about Cleopatra? Sure she was a queen and drop dead gorgeous (no pun intended), but that’s about it, right?

Lucky for you, Vicky Alvear Shecter’s here today. And she’s brought her totally awesome book, Cleopatra Rules! The Amazing Life of the Original Teen Queen. Vicky knows everything about Cleopatra, and Egypt, and Julius Caesar and love and murder, and…well, why don’t I let her tell you about it. 

Thanks for stopping by, Vicky! First off, I have to say I’ve never read anything quite like Cleopatra Rules! I can’t remember when I laughed out loud, reading history. And there were more than a few surprises in there about Cleopatra. What do you think is the surprise that shocks most people about the teen queen?

What shocked me most was the fact that Cleopatra was the mother of four children. Yup, four. One by Caesar, three by Marc Antony. Only her daughter, Cleopatra Selene, survived into adulthood. She became the focus of my YA novel, Cleopatra’s Moon, coming out this August.

 The research for your book is beyond impressive! Did you find any other surprising tidbits when digging around Cleopatra and her contemporaries? (Oops! Sorry for that pun, too)

Thanks! One word about the research—because the “voice” in the book is kind of “out there,” I had to make sure that the research was unimpeachable. I wanted to prove that a fun casual voice could be part of rigorously researched biography. We also had two ancient history experts (archaeologists) and two Cleopatra experts (professors) vet the book.

What is most surprising to many people is that Cleopatra was no great beauty. According to Plutarch she was “okay” (my words, not his!), but had an amazing charisma that made her irresistible.  I hate that Hollywood makes her into a bombshell because here we have the classic case of an ordinary-looking young woman who—by the force of her intelligence, wit, and personality—changes the history of the world. That is WAY more interesting, don’t you think?

Absolutely! And when you consider what she accomplished in such a short span of history (um, how many years was that again?) it’s easy to see why Hollywood’s made so many movies about her reign as Pharaoh. But I’m wondering if there’s ever been a movie that accurately depicted Cleopatra. Why change the story when the real story is so amazing? 

I have yet to find an accurate depiction of Cleopatra in the movies for the reasons stated above—Hollywood needs to sell tickets and they figure people will only pay to see a great beauty on the screen rather than a great mind. Also, it’s really hard to convey the political situations in both Egypt and Rome so it becomes easier to frame her story as a love story. It’s not.  It’s the story or a brilliant young woman who gambled on creating alliances with the powerful in Rome in order to keep her kingdom independent and strong.

But who wants to see that when you can watch Elizabeth Taylor snog Richard Burton?

Oh, and she ruled for 22 years, by the way. 

Only 22 years! Imagine how the world might be different if she’d lived longer. I don’t want to give up too many of the juicy details from Cleopatra Rules! but I can’t let you go without asping, er, asking about that famous death scene. So, what really happened?

 Ah, the dead scene. So classic, isn’t it? The thing that really cracks me up is that there are people STILL arguing about it. Just months ago, there was a prominent scientist who crowed that he had proved that Cleopatra died by a cocktail of poisons rather than a snakebite.

Really? Without a body on which to perform toxicological tests? 

We have to remember that the only account of her death was written 90 years later by a Roman Greek (Plutarch) who didn’t want to anger the Roman emperor. He HAD to make Cleo look bad. It was his job. Plutarch himself said he didn’t know whether it was by snake or poison.

Snakes, however, were powerful Egyptian symbols of both royalty and eternal life.  Cleopatra knew how to make a dramatic entrance. Why not a dramatic exit too?

I go deeper into what I believe, in the book, of course!

Indeed, you do. Cleopatra Rules! is a riveting read!

Vicky, thank you SO much for sharing your wit and wisdom here. And Vicky’s also graciously given a copy of Cleopatra Rules! to Finders & Keepers for one lucky commenter to win. So if you’re a librarian, looking for a way to get kids excited about history, you’ll want to comment. And if you’re a kid with the Dreaded History Report to write, you’ll want to leave a comment. And especially, if you’re the parent of the kid with the Dreaded History Report to write, leave a comment. (But honestly, you might just want to run out and buy Cleopatra Rules! Because how often do you find a history book that’s this much fun?)

Thanks so much, Cathy! This was fun!

P.S. Here’s another keeper for you: History with a Twist! You’ll find a ton of interesting historical facts and fun at Vicky’s blog. And if you’re penning your own non-fiction book, you’ll want to check out Vicky’s writing tips over at my other blog, Cathy C.’s Hall of Fame. She’s giving away something over there, too. Finders, keepers. Losers, weepers. So what are you waiting for?